Foreign Secretary David Miliband's interview to Russian Newsweek magazine. (01/11/2009)
Who is to blame for the fact that out of all West European countries Russia has probably the worst relations with Britain?
You're misjudging the bilateral relationship on the basis of one or two areas of disagreement. Our disagreements are well known, they are serious, and they have not gone away. But the UK and Russia have a broad relationship and if you look at the practical cooperation between our two countries, in areas such as trade and investment, culture or tourism, it's a very productive relationship too. And as two Permanent members of the Security Council, two G8 and G20 countries, we work closely on the global challenges which affect us all, not least solutions to the global economic crisis, which affect jobs and growth and the foreign policy issues of the day from Iran, to Afghanistan, Pakistan, the Middle East Peace Process or Climate Change, I believe that we have a lot to gain from working together.
We understand that Iran and Afghanistan are going to be the main issues on this visit’s agenda. What kind of contribution you expect from Russia on these issues? Do you expect Moscow to support tougher sanctions against Iran?
The International Community has made it clear that Iran needs to demonstrate that she is complying with her international obligations as set out in a succession of UN Security Council resolutions. Russia and the UK - as two Permanent Members of the Security Council - are working together through the E3 plus 3 format to ensure that Iran's nuclear programme is exclusively for peaceful purposes. The E3+3 met with Iranian officials on 1 October in Geneva. At this meeting, Iran pledged to cooperate fully with the International Atomic Energy Agency on the new enrichment facility.
We have consistently said that we do not wish to deny Iran the right to civil nuclear power. But Iran must show the world that they are prepared to have the proper safeguards and inspections so that the international community can have confidence in Iran's intentions.
Iran must demonstrate its commitment to an intensive and constructive process. The Tehran Research Reactor deal is one measure of Iranian good faith to that process. Agreement on fuel for the Tehran Research Reactor might be a positive step, but does not replace the need for Iran to act now to restore confidence in its overall programme. To do this Iran needs to be fully transparent about its existing programme. And it needs to answer all of the outstanding questions relating to past nuclear related activities, including possible military dimensions to the programme.
Afghanistan is, along with Pakistan, at the top of the UK's current foreign policy priorities. Russia shares our interest in seeking a stable, democratic Afghanistan. Russia has agreed transit agreements with several NATO partners and is carrying out counter-narcotics training for Afghan police officials under the auspices of the NATO-Russia Council. We hope we can find more ways in which we can cooperate.
The new US administration has signalled a much softer approach to Russia’s internal issues such as human rights and democratic institutions. Should your visit that comes after years of very frosty relations between Russian and Britain be interpreted along the same lines?
It is not for me to comment on US/Russia relations. This is indeed the first bilateral visit by a FS for some time. But Britain and Russia talk to each other at a high level all the time; My last meeting with Foreign Minister Lavrov was in New York just over a month ago, and our Prime Minister sees President Medvedev regularly - most recently in Pittsburgh in September. And later this week Finance Minister Kudrin is off to London for the latest round of bilateral Trade and Investment talks with Lord Mandelson. This visit is a chance to reinvigorate relations and refresh my memories of Moscow.
The UK/Russia relationship covers many areas, including human rights and democracy. This is not about a softer approach, but about a mature approach where we acknowledge each others' concerns and speak frankly. I will meet representatives of Russian civil society while I am in Moscow, and we have regular opportunities to raise our concerns with the Russian authorities. We have held a bilateral human rights dialogue with Russia for a number of years now, most recently in Moscow in January 2009. I believe respect for human rights, rule of law and democratic institutions are as much in Russia's interest as in our own.
In August 2008, you likened Russia’s actions in Georgia to the Soviet invasion of Czechoslovakia. Later the same month you said that ‘Russia needs to change course’. Do you still stand by these words now that EU commission’s report revealed that the first shot in that war was fired by the Georgians?
Our position on the conflict remains that Georgia made mistakes. But Russia’s use of force, which extended the geographical range of the conflict and the scale of fighting,was disproportionate. Russia’s violation of Georgian sovereignty and territorial integrity, which continues to this day was not justified.
Back then you also promised ‘serious military and political cooperation’ with the aim of bringing Georgia and Ukraine closer to joining NATO. We haven’t seen many signs of this cooperation. Do you still see their accession a feasible short- or middle-term task? When they might join?
The door to NATO remains open to countries demonstrating and sharing the values that underpin the Alliance. NATO Foreign Ministers in December agreed a number of steps to provide further assistance to Georgia and Ukraine in implementing needed reforms as they progress towards NATO membership. This included the development of Annual National Programmes to help Georgia and Ukraine advance their reforms. NATO is now working with both aspirants to help them take this forward. I do not see this as a threat to Russia. I would like to see stronger NATO-Russia links.
Abkhazia and South Ossetia have been de-facto independent for almost 20 years – a span of one generation. Do you agree that at this stage they might merit direct contacts with EU countries which Kosovo enjoyed when it tried to secede from Serbia? How long their aspirations can be ignored for?
We do not support Russia's decision to recognise South Ossetia/Abkhazia, which was unilateral, and has not helped to bring security to the region. The recognition of South Ossetia/Abkhazia has shown how little support they have globally (only Nicaragua and Venezuela have joined them). We have made it clear that in our view the particular circumstances around Kosovo make it a unique case.
Kosovo declared independence as a last-resort following a UN-led political process to agree its final status. That process included Russia. Recognition of Kosovo's independence is consistent with the relevant Security Council Resolutions. Russia's recognition of South Ossetia and Abkhazia, taken together with its military intervention, is not. The Geneva talks, established under the Sarkozy-Medvedev agreements after the conflict last year, are now the place for discussions on security and stability in Georgia. Russia and the EU participate in these talks, along with the UN and OSCE. We strongly support the continuation of discussions in this format.
What is the status of the investigation into the death of Alexander Litvinenko and how your visit might help to advance it? What is your attitude to the fact that the main suspect in the case, Andrey Lugovoy, has been elected to the Russian parliament?
The UK authorities completed their investigation a long time ago. It was on the strength of this investigation that the Crown Prosecution Service - which, as I always have to remind people, operates independently of the government - determined that there was a case to answer and requested the extradition of Andrei Lugovoy. Unfortunately they have yet to receive a satisfactory response to that request.
Mr Lugovoy may be a member of the Duma, but he is still a wanted man. So we remain open to constructive proposals from the Russian government that will see this chilling murder, committed in the UK, brought to justice in a UK court.
What exactly happened during your conversation with Sergei Lavrov in September 2008 when he was allegedly using foul language? Which of his words prompted this allegation? Did he actually insist that you shouldn’t lecture him?
Foreign Minister Lavrov and I talk regularly, and we talk about a lot of things. I don't want to go into the detail of those conversations. I have a lot of respect for Sergei Lavrov. And the passion we bring to our discussions is a reminder of how seriously we take each other’s views.
Are you expecting any progress in British Council’s saga in Russia? Many Russians feel sad about its disappearance from major cities.
You're absolutely right, many Russians feel very sad about the enforced closure of the British Council's offices outside Moscow. Whatever the British Council does in Russia, across the spheres of art, science, culture and education, it's a tremendously popular organisation which benefits hundreds of thousands of Russians every year. Look at the UK Film Festival which is on in Moscow at the moment, for example. Thousands of people came to the opening last week. Or the Turner Exhibition last year, which over 200,000 people attended. The British Council is a cultural, not a political institution, and we strongly reject any attempt to link it to other areas of the bilateral relationship.
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